Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

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rosieno1
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Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:19 pm

Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by rosieno1 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:08 am

Hi - Looking for help !

My Great great grandfather Patrick Reynolds & his wife Ellen (or Eleanor or Helen on occasions) Connolly first appeared in the Scottish records in 1851Census at Eastmuir, Shettleston, Lanarkshire, along with his son William 1 year old, born Tollcross, Lanarkshire. At this time Patrick an Ellen were given as 24 years old, and were given as born in Ireland. They are widely believed to have come over from Antrim, Patrick from Cushendall and Ellen from Carnlough, both coastal towns in the 'Glens of Antrim' area. Other family historians give specific dates of birth, Patrick from 23, and Ellen from 27, ie they were not the same age, as indicated on the above Census. However no one seems to have any real evidence of these facts, I guess they have been passed down in some way, but, how accurate I dont know?

Anyway, through the 1861 & 1871 census returns, we see them with their growing brood of a family, summarised as below:-

William (dob approx 1850)
Jane (dob approx 1852)
Sarah (dob approx 1854)
Patrick (dob 02.02.1856)
Catherine (dob 1858 - some say born back in Ireland - cant find a Scottish cert.)
John ( dob approx 1860)
Francis (dob approx 1864)
Joseph (dob 08.08.1868 - my great grandfather!)

By 1881 the remaining unmarried family with Patrick and Ellen, and some of the married kids with their families had moved out to Omoa Square (now part of Cleland) in Lanarkshire.

Now I get to my reason for posting. As you will see, Patrick & Ellen would not have been very young when William was born, Possibly 23, but in John's case Possibly 27. It would have been entirely possible that they had children before William. However they seemed to have been a very close family, living close to each other for 40 years, and moving out together from Shettleston to Omoa square.

Some family historians suggest that there was an older brother Richard (1849 being proposed), however he doesn't appear on any of the census returns you would expect - 51/61/71. This Richard Reynolds was married in Newarthill in 1873 to Mary Lafferty. His address was given as Omoa Foundry, and his parents were given as Patrick Reynolds & Ellen Reynolds MS Connelly!

This same Richard died in 1917 aged 62 years at Stane Place, Stane, Cambusnethan (in the district of Calderhead per the certificate) His (living) wife was given as Mary Lafferty, so I know it is the same person. Anyway, on the death certificate, his parents are given as Patrick Reynolds & Ellen, MS Oneill.

Anyway, I'm looking for help to establish where this Richard came from, could he have been a brother of my Great grand father?

Of course I know that ten yearly census returns are only a momentary snapshot of life, and there is always an explanation for some one not being 'there' at the appropriate time. If there is an explanation, then perhaps he was born out of wedlock, prior to the family coming to Scotland. Or possibly for some other reason he was left in the care of grand parents who remained back in Antrim? Perhaps he only came over to Scotland at a later date, as an adult?

If the discrepancy on the parental names given on his marriage and death certs had been the other way round, it would have been more understandable! More mistakes are made on death certs than on marriage certs. - the person notifying may never have met the deceased's parents, never mind know the mothers maiden name!

Anyway, any ideas ?


Thanks for any help given

rosieno1
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:19 pm

Re: Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by rosieno1 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:53 am

Sorry - intended to put this under general discussion - I dont know how to move it!

LesleyB
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Re: Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by LesleyB » Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:01 am

Hi rosieno1
- I've moved it. Only Moderators or Admin are able to move posts on the forum, so not surprising you could not work out how to do it! :D
Best wishes
Lesley

rosieno1
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:19 pm

Re: Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by rosieno1 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:12 am

Ta Lesley!

nelmit
Posts: 3895
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Location: Scotland

Re: Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by nelmit » Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:17 am

Doesn't help much but I think this is him in 1861 at 18 Braehead Row, Old Monkland-

Samuel Peebles 36
Mary Peebles 32
Richd Peebles 10
Samuel Peebles 8
John Peebles 6
James Peebles 4
Hugh Peebles 3 MO
Richard Ronalds 13 born New Monkland, boarder

Regards,
Annette

rosieno1
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:19 pm

Re: Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by rosieno1 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:26 am

Thanks Annette - I have been trying to find him on the 71 census - obviously if i find him with parents, independent of my couple, it indicates that they are separate families!

rosieno1
Posts: 44
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2009 11:19 pm

Re: Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by rosieno1 » Sat Jun 25, 2011 1:00 pm

Hi again

On the 1881 census Richard with his wife & 3 kids (Patrick, Ellen & Mary) stated he was born in Airdrie. That would indicate that the possible 1861 find for Richard Ronalds is a definite possibility.

If that is so, then I cant think he is part of my family, for why would he be living as a boarder in Monklands at the tender age of 13, while his parents and 8 siblings were living comparatively near by, in Eastmuir Shettleston.

But on the other hand, Richard and wife and their family, are found on the 1881 & 1891 census at Omoa Square, Just like my Reynolds clan.

Of course Omoa Square was a (not exclusively), Irish enclave (I hesitate to use Ghetto!) where only the poorest of the poor lived, and was designated as uninhabitable in the early twentieth century - it wasn't worth renovating. After 1900 the entire area was simply known as Cleland. This being the case perhaps Omoa Square was an entirely natural place for them to live - whether he had family there or not!

On reviewing my posts I noted that I did not have exact dob's for Francis & John, and I tried again on the Scotland's People website. Cant say i found anything definite. On the census in 1881 Catherine indicates she was born in Ireland, and under the circumstances that prevailed then, I don't think you would say so unless it were true. John and Francis seem to indicate they were born in Barony - does that district include Shettleston?

Certainly if it were true that a number of kids were born in Ireland, it would indicate that the family moved back and forward much more often than I had realised, and it would make the possibility of siblings being left in Ireland more likely and understandable.

I have not really come to any conclusions, other than that:-

If the Richard on the census in 1861 in Monklands is the Richard I am discussing, then I don't think he is part of my family. If it is not him, then I still think it is a possibility he stayed in Ireland and came to join the rest of the family when older. I would also note that my Grandmother Jane Reynolds had a brother Richard - so it was to some extent a family name! He was the third male child, the first two being named for their Grandfathers, Patrick and Hugh. Obviously it is way too late to ask my Grand mother who her beloved Dick, was named after. I don't see any other obvious family member that he might have been named after.

You might think i'm swaying towards accepting Richard as a brother in the family, but to be honest I just don't know! I am very good at laying out the circumstantial evidence, looking at it, and weighing up the likelyhoods, but in this situation I am stumped! I need hard evidence, and I suspect I might be waiting a long time!

However I would love someone to prove me wrong!

crayspond
Posts: 560
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2007 6:23 am
Location: Reading UK

Re: Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by crayspond » Wed Jul 20, 2011 9:44 am

Hi Rosieno1,

This may have no bearing on your Reynolds family whatsoever, but in the past I have been researching my husband’s family name of Reynolds and have gathered some information back to 1850. The descendant is named James Reynolds born c.1827 in Sligo . He was married to Mary Sweeny or Sweenie 06/01/1850 in Gorbals Glasgow.
– this is him in the1851 census

James Reynolds
Age: 24
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1827
Relationship: Son-in-law
Gender: Male
Where born: Ireland, Sligo
Parish Number: 644/2
Civil Parish: Gorbals
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 4 Nicolson Street
Occupation: Porter
ED: 14B
Household schedule number: 8
Line: 5
Roll: CSSCT1851_165
Household Members: Name Age
Janes Dawson 8
Hugh Glancey 24
James Reynolds 24
Bridget Sweenie 55
Charles Sweenie 56
Charles Sweenie 15
Mary Sweenie 21

They married and had the following children (info found on the LDS site) although their first born was Charles who is not on the list below. He was born c. 1853


1. CATHERINE REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British Isles
Gender: Female Birth: 04 JUL 1868 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove] 2. PATRICK REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British Isles
Gender: Male Birth: 12 SEP 1863 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove] 3. JAMES REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British Isles
Gender: Male Birth: 12 SEP 1863 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove] 4. FRANCIS REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British Isles
Gender: Male Birth: 07 JUL 1857 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove] 5. MARY REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British Isles
Gender: Female Birth: 05 AUG 1858 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove] 6. MARY REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British Isles
Gender: Female Birth: 30 JUN 1859 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove] 7. ELIZABETH REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British IslesGender: Female Birth: 12 APR 1855 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove] 8. ELIZABETH DOYLE REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British Isles
Gender: Female Birth: 24 SEP 1861 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove] 9. MARGARET THOMLINE REYNOLDS - International Genealogical Index - British Isles
Gender: Female Birth: 06 SEP 1865 Tradeston, Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland [Remove]

What is interesting is that a few of the same first names occur in your family - like Francis and Patrick Reynolds.
James Reynolds died in 1890 in Hutchesontown and his parents were Francis Reynolds and Mary Reynolds m.s Lanaghan.
The connection to your Patrick may be they were brothers or maybe cousins. Did you look for a death cert for Patrick ?
Another coincidence is that my husband’s grandfather lived and is buried in Cambusnethan .

Maybe there is a connection somewhere !

Ailsa

raymond82
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 1:49 pm

Re: Reynolds Family in Lanarkshire

Post by raymond82 » Sat Mar 18, 2017 3:01 pm

Family of William and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty
Daniel Nolan, born May 5th. 1895, in Cleland, registered on May 17th. Cleland, parents William Nolan and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty, who were married July 9th. 1879,in Chapelhall
Peter Nolan, born April 21st. 1880, at Auchinlee, Cleland, parents, William Nolan, quarry man and Mary Nolan nee Lavery, married July 9th,18790 Chapelhall ,Holytown
William Nolan, Cleland died Jan. 27th. 1904, age 16, parents, William Nolan quarry man, deceased, and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty, Peter Nolan, brother was present at death
Patrick Nolan, born April 22nd. 1890 at Auchinlee, Cleland, Parents, William Nolan, quarry man, and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty, married 28th. July 1879, Chapelhall, Holytown ?
James Nolan, born June 29th. 1881Omoa square Cleland, Parents, William Nolan, quarry man and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty, married July 9th. 1879,in Chapelhall
Bridget Nolan, born Jan. 24th. 1893 at Omoa square Cleland, parents, William Nolan quarry man and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty, married July 9th. 1879,in Cleland
kate Nolan, born 1886, parents, William Nolan quarry man and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty, married July 9th. 1879,in Cleland

NOLAN NOTES
William Nolan, head age 40, quarryman, born Ireland, 1861, died 1902, in Cleland
Mary Nolan, wife nee Lavery, age 44, born, Bothwell, Lanarkshire, 1857, Death May 3rd.1934 Mary Nolan, born 1858, 22 Carfin road Newarthill, widow of William Nolan, age 76, born 1858 died May
5th. 1934, parents were James Lafferty, coal miner, deceased, and Bessie Lafferty, nee Speirs, deceased, Son Daniel was present at death
Mary Nolan, wife nee Lafferty, age 44, born, Bothwell, Lanarkshire, 1857, Death May 3rd.1934 Mary Nolan, born 1858, 22 Carfin road Newarthill, widow of William Nolan, age 76, born 1858 died May 5th. 1934, parents were James Lafferty, coal miner, deceased, and Bessie Lafferty, nee Speirs, deceased, Son Daniel was present at death
Peter Nolan, age 23, quarry man, Johnstons land, Cleland, Marriage 1 Dec.1903, R. C. Chapel, Cleland , parents William Nolan, quarryman deceased, and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty married
Ellen Faughnan, brick field worker, age 22, 22 Omoa Square, Cleland, parents, Edward Faughnan, coalminer, mother, Annie Faughnan, nee Keatings deceased, witnesses were James Glass and Annie Donnelly
James Nolan, coal miner ,age 24, Omoa road, Cleland, married Mary Carroll, 31st. Dec.1907, Cleland Chapel, parents were William Nolan, quarry man deceased and Mary Nolan, nee Lafferty
Mary Carroll, age 21 , Omoa square, parents, William Carroll, labourer and Mary Carroll nee Murphy, Witnesses , James Carroll and Lizzie Carroll
Patrick Nolan, age 22, 6 Omoa square, parents William Nolan quarry man deceased and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty, married Ellen Reynolds, age 18, Cleland Chapel, 12 July, 1912
Parents of Ellen Reynolds were William Reynolds, coal miner, and Ellen Reynolds nee Donnelly, deceased, witnesses were Daniel Nolan and Catherine Larkins
Kate Nolan, brick worker, age 26, 7 Omoa square, Cleland, married 12 July 1912, Cleland Chapel, parents William Nolan, quarry man, deceased and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty
Denis Dowling, age 23, 35 Omoa square Cleland, parents Michael Dowling, coal miner, deceased and Margaret Dowling nee Ryan, witnesses John Nash and Bridget Nolan
Bridget Nolan, age 21, 159 Omoa road, Cleland, parents, William Nolan, quarry man, deceased, and Mary Nolan nee Lafferty, married John O'Neill, age 22, Pottery buildings Cleland
17th. July 1914,Cleland Chapel, parents Joseph O'Neill coal miner and Mary O'Neill nee McMahan, witnesses were James O'Neill and Lizzie Greenan
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raymondtheresearcher@gmail.com

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