Real Expert Advice Required

[Andy]

I'm in a quandary, and long time TalkingScot users know I'm very thorough.

I have an illegitimate William Lewis Clark born 1896, three years after his mother's husband died.

William's mother and her Husband, John Clark, a butcher, were married in Paisley and had at least five legitimate children before John died in 1893 aged just 29. Thing is that a William Irvine Clark (middle name from Granny) was born to this couple in 1889. I wondered why two boys were named William. I then found a sailor, William Lewis, living just along the road from the mother Jane (Garven) Clark in 1895. Then found a local Kirk Session Record where Jane names William Lewis (a sailor) as her son's father. He didn't admit it!

If Davie, Sporran or any of the "Old Timers" are available, please advise whether I can continue the research based upon Jane (Garven) Clark's assertion that William Lewis is the father.

I don't take "leaps-of-faith" in my research but every fibre of my being THINKS that Mary (Garven) Clark named-and-shamed a paramour William Lewis.

AM I SAFE TO RESEARCH WILLIAM LEWIS'S LINES?

Cheers M'Dears,

Andy

[Orlaith17]

When you say that William Lewis was named as the father but he didn't admit it, do you mean that he didn't sign the register? If he was a sailor, he may simply not have been around at the time to sign the register. Illegitimate births were more common than I would have imagined. I have come across a few illegitimate births in my own family research (and I didn't expect that as they were Catholic, from Irish parents!) I noticed that one record had a child named as illegitimate, but both parents had signed the register. The child was "legitimised" later when the parents married.
My guess at two boys being named William would be that the elder one had died before the younger was born. Again, that happened in my family a couple of times, where records showed two children of the same name, but one had died young. In one case, the next child born was given the name of his sibling who had died the previous year.
If I were in your situation, I would be inclined to research the lines of the person named as the father. It seems unlikely that the mother named him and named the child after him if he wasn't the father. I am also very thorough by the way and don't accept anything as concrete truth until I have cross referenced it more than once.

[Moray_Lass]

Not an old timer but have you continued checking through the Kirk Session Minutes past the first entry. And when you say he didn't admit it, did he deny it? I have one where it rumbled on in the KSM for years before the father admitted it - by letter.

[Andy]

William Irvine Clark lived to a ripe old age as did his "half" brother William Lewis Clark (in the 1901 census he was named Lewis but the birth cert is William Lewis).

No father mentioned on the Birth Cert but the during the Session Court Jane named William Lewis, a sailor, as the father - he didn't turn up!

Jane (Garven) Clark married another chap William Walker in 1908 but she was living with him and all her children in 1901. By 1911 there were two additions to the family Mina born 1902 and Jessie born 1904 they were both listed as illegitimate but William Walker signed both certificates before he married Jane.

[Laura]

Just to stir the pot: my father had two brothers christened, George, because their parents named the first two sons after the maternal and paternal grandfathers, both named George. They nicknamed one of the young Georges, Andrew, but his birth record states his name was George.

[Wee Ann]

My Great Grandfather was Donald McPherson, born c 1837 Kilmonivaig, Inverness-shire. He had an older brother, also Donald McPherson who, as far as I can make out from the census, also lived to manhood. Why would anyone name a child the same as his living older brother? As my Yorkshire-born husband would say "There's nowt so strange as folk!"

[Laura]

Why would anyone name a child the same as his living older brother?

Wee Ann, are you familiar with the traditional naming patterns in Scotland?

[AnneM]

Hi Andy,

This is a difficult one, a bit like my putative great grandfather Hermann the German. I would say that you have William Lewis nailed as the Dad on the balance of probabilities but not beyond reasonable doubt. Only you can make the decision on whether or not that is good enough for you but I suspect that it is as good as it will get. I would be inclined to research his ancestry but make a cautionary note that this is dependent on mother having been correct and truthful and the neighbouring William Lewis being the correct one. I take it that his age makes it plausible that he is the father.

Anne

Can I just add that by replying on this thread I am certainly not holding myself out as a real expert.

[Wee Ann]

Hi Laura,
Do you mean - "boys named after father's father - mother's father - girls for mother's mother - father's mother"? If so, I don't see how that comes into it in this case! Two boys as far as I can tell same parents, born about five years apart given the same name!
Best regards
Ann

[Laura]

Both of my father's grandfathers were named George. My father's first two brothers were named George, after each of their grandfathers. One of the Georges went by the nickname, Andrew, but George is on his legal documents.