Totally stuck

Northern Ireland and Eire

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Orlaith17
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2011 10:50 pm

Totally stuck

Post by Orlaith17 » Sun Feb 14, 2016 1:50 pm

I have been researching my family tree on my father's side for years. Both grandparents' were born in Scotland, but their parents came from Ireland. I got quite far back on gran's side but have reached a dead stop on grandad's. Hoping someone can help or advise. Grandad's name was Thomas Hannan. His father was also Thomas. According to 1901 census, grandad's father was born in Ireland. Grandad's mother was Scottish and his parents married in Scotland. From their marriage record, I could see that great grandad Thomas' parents were called Hugh Hannan and Jane McGee/McGhie. I have a death certificate for great grandad in Scotland and from age at death given on that, can work out he was born around 1849. His age given on his marriage certificate doesn't give the same birth year but I know things could be a bit confused and people often weren't sure of their date of birth. I can't find a birth record for Thomas senior in Ireland. I also can find nothing at all for Hugh And Jane. I have searched with Ancestry and also Family Search (I have found them good for Irish records in the past). I did find a Hugh Hannan and his wife Jane living in USA who were both born in Ireland, and their ages would be about right. But no way to find out more to confirm if it is the right people or not. If anyone could give any advice, I would really appreciate it.

Elwyn 1
Posts: 138
Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2010 8:34 pm
Location: Co. Antrim, Ireland

Re: Totally stuck

Post by Elwyn 1 » Sun Feb 14, 2016 2:21 pm

Statutory registration of births and deaths only started in Ireland in 1864, so you won’t get a birth certificate for Thomas born c 1849. You might find his baptism but to do that ideally you really need to know his denomination and roughly where he was born. Not all parish records are on-line. Rootsireland probably has the most comprehensive set. It’s a subscription site but even then they probably only have about half of the available records.

If the family were RC then most of the parish registers are on-line free on the National Library site but they are not indexed and so if you don’t know the parish, they won’t be much use.

http://registers.nli.ie/parishes

Non RC marriages were recorded in the Irish statutory registers from 1845 onwards. However RC marriages were only recorded from 1864. I assume this was an RC marriage. If so, you face the same problem as the baptism.

Usual advice in this situation is to exhaust all Scottish sources to see if you can get a clue as to where in Ireland they came from. Check every census. Sometimes you get more than “Ireland” as place of birth; check wills, obituaries and gravestones; check military records etc. Check the Poor Law records. If they claimed under the Poor Law then often their parish of origin is recorded in the Scottish files.

Orlaith17
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2011 10:50 pm

Re: Totally stuck

Post by Orlaith17 » Sun Feb 14, 2016 8:13 pm

Thanks for that. Yes, they were RC. My grandmother' family came from Drumcliffe and Magherow, Sligo but no clue where grandad's family came from. I tried Scottish parish records just in case he hadn't actually been born in Ireland at all. But nothing there or in Census to show him and parents in Scotland. I will have a look at link you sent, thank you.

WilmaM
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Location: Falkirk area

Re: Totally stuck

Post by WilmaM » Mon Feb 15, 2016 12:37 am

What about siblings? Have you checked to see if any of them were born in Scotland ? A Scots birth cert could give a marriage place for the parents.
Wonka2

Orlaith17
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2011 10:50 pm

Re: Totally stuck

Post by Orlaith17 » Wed Feb 17, 2016 2:31 am

Thanks for suggestion. Yes, I had considered that he may not actually have been born in Ireland, but there is nothing in Scottish records for him except a death certificate. My grandad and his siblings were born in Scotland, as was his mother, but his father's birthplace was given as Ireland on census. Not sure when he came to Scotland, but he married in Scotland.

Orlaith17
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2011 10:50 pm

Re: Totally stuck

Post by Orlaith17 » Sat Oct 08, 2016 10:22 am

Ho hum. Been searching every possible source I can for birth of great grandad but can't find him anywhere. I have his parents names from his marriage certificate as he married in Scotland. His age on marriage certificate in 1880 was given as 30. But his age on death certificate in 1891 was recorded as 45. Making his birth 1846 -1850. I've started to wonder if parent names he gave on his marriage certificate were correct. Plenty of people with his name born in Ireland in that time period, but none with these parent names...so frustrating :?

nelmit
Posts: 3894
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:49 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: Totally stuck

Post by nelmit » Sat Oct 08, 2016 4:59 pm

I'm a wee bit confused......doesn't take much these days mind you.

You say that you have g grandad's death entry in 1891 but that he is stated as born in Ireland in 1901 census. :? Did you mean 1891 census?

Is this the family in 1891?

Thos Hannan 45 born Ireland
Jessie Hannan 37 born Ayr
Esther Hannan 15
Margt Hannan 10
Jane Hannan 8
Thos Hannan 3

Regards,
Annette

Orlaith17
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2011 10:50 pm

Re: Totally stuck

Post by Orlaith17 » Sat Feb 25, 2017 7:31 pm

Sorry, Annette, yes, that's them. I put wrong census in error. Great grandfather died in September 1891, so later in the year of the 1891 census. I have his marriage certificate to Jessie, as they were married in Scotland in 1880. His parents were named on that certificate as Hugh Hannan and Jane McGee. I have trawled through Irish records as well as Scottish ones in case he was mistaken about where he was born. His age on his marriage certificate in 1880 was given as 30, making his year of birth about 1850. But his age on his death certificate in 1891 was given as 45, making his year of birth about 1846. So with some doubt about when he was actually born, there may be other errors recorded, eg his parents' names? I cant get a birth for him anywhere, or any record for his parents.

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