drowning at sea

Fisherman, Merchant vessels, Emigrant ships etc.

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marionbe
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:15 pm
Location: west lothian

drowning at sea

Post by marionbe » Fri Sep 26, 2008 9:56 pm

Hi folks


I have just learned of my ggfather's death, one of the family have informed me that they remember getting told that he and his 2 sond drowned at sea, but I cannot find any death certificate for him at all.
He lived in Largs in Ayr scotland, I have tried in SP and cannot find him,I found his wife's death certificate but can't find his anywhere or his sons.

I think it was a fishing boat accident, his name was a Charles Mowat and he was born 1857.
Can anybody suggest where I can look now.

It's driving me crazy.

Thanks Marion
Gilmour, Bishop,Menzies,Simpson

WilmaM
Posts: 1870
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 10:46 am
Location: Falkirk area

Post by WilmaM » Fri Sep 26, 2008 10:08 pm

Can you give us some idea of when he may have died?

Like:
Was his wife a widow on her death cert. ?
Was he marked as deceased on the marriage cert. of your G Grandparent's marriage
or have you found him alive on any census returns?

Just to narrow things down a little.

It's conceivable that he could have died in Irish or English waters ...
Wilma

marionbe
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:15 pm
Location: west lothian

drowning at sea

Post by marionbe » Sat Sep 27, 2008 11:59 am

Hi WilmaM'

thanks for answering me, I have their marraige certificate from 1844, and her death certificate and on it it says that she was the widow of Charles Mowat formerly Merchant Service, that was in 1887 she was 60 years old ,
so trying to find him from 1844 and 1887 they had three children, she died at Largs in Ayrshire.
I have a copy opf one of their sons a Charles Mowat born in 1857 and the father was a Merchant seaman for his occupation , and that was in Irvine in Ayrshire, apart form these certificates I can't seen to find anything else about them.

Marion
Gilmour, Bishop,Menzies,Simpson

WilmaM
Posts: 1870
Joined: Fri Dec 17, 2004 10:46 am
Location: Falkirk area

Post by WilmaM » Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:35 pm

So is it this one?

CHARLES MOWAT
Spouse: JANE PARR
Marriage: 28 DEC 1844 Irvine, Ayr, Scotland


If so they only seem to have had 1 son:

CHARLES MOWAT Male
Birth: 10 FEB 1857 Irvine, Ayr, Scotland
Father: CHARLES MOWAT Family
Mother: JANE PARR
Extracted birth or christening record


Have you found your own direct decendant's census etc details?
I assume as you say Charles is your Ggrandfather - then a son or daughter of his will be your Grandfather or mother.

Giving us as much detail as you have, helps the good folks on here to help you more quickly.

At a quick glance I'm not seeing any obvious candidates on the IGI or Freecen. Mowat seems to be a Shetland name?
Wilma

SarahND
Site Admin
Posts: 5631
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 12:47 am
Location: France

Post by SarahND » Sat Sep 27, 2008 4:00 pm

Hi Marion and Wilma,
Here they are in some of the censuses: There were daughters Janet and Agnes as well.

1851
Bridgegate, Irvine, Ayr
Jean Mowet, 25, Head, born Irvine, Ayr, Sailor Wife
Janet Mowet, 3, Daughter, born Irvine, Ayr
Agnes Mowet, 10 Mo, Daughter, born Irvine, Ayr

1861 is confusing... I think this might be Jean with perhaps her sister-in-law?

1861
Fullarton St, Dundonald, Ayrshire
Jean Mowat, 36, Head, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Muslin Sewer
Agnes Mowat, 34, Sister, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Muslin Sewer
James Dunn, 25, Boarder, born Ireland, Stone Mason

Here is Agnes, but where are Janet and Charles?

1861
Castle Pannfield Rosebank, Irvine, Ayrshire
Jane C Johnston, 63, Head, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Widow of the Late M Johnston Town Clerk of Irvine
Elizabeth Johnston, 21, Daughter, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Daughter Widow of the Late M Johnston Town Clerk of Irvine
Mary Cowan, 19, Servant, born Stevenston, Ayrshire, Domestic Servant
Agnes Mowat, 10, Servant, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Domestic Servant

Did Jean remarry to someone named Graner and then think better of it? I can't see any obvious marriage record.

1871
Mault Street Marse Court, Largs, Ayrshire
Jean Graner, 48, Head, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Washer Woman
Agnes Mowat, 21, Daur, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Domestic Servant
Chrles Mowat, 14, Son, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Unemployed

1881
6 Allan Park Place, Largs, Ayrshire
Jane Mowat, 62, Head, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Washer Cleaner
Charles Mowat, 22, Son, born Irvine, Ayrshire, Fisherman

So... she is a wife in 1851 and thereafter appears to be earning her own living. Not sure about 1861, but her husband must have died between the conception of Charles in 1856 and 1871 at latest. My guess, anyway...

All the best,
Sarah

marionbe
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:15 pm
Location: west lothian

drowning at sea

Post by marionbe » Sat Sep 27, 2008 5:56 pm

Hi Wilma & Sarah,

Thanks for your help on Jane Mowat's death certificate her address was at Allanpark Street, and her daughter signed it. Her daughter was married to my Grandfather, and we were always told that they had 3 sons and that tqwo of them drowned with the father after a fishing boat accident.

That must have been them on the census for allanpark place, but I still can't find a death certificate for him on SP. I wonder why?
I have only managed to get her certificate and she was a widow on her death certificate in 1887.
Her daughter Jane(same name as her mother) came to West Lothian and married my Grandfather in Armadale.

Marion
Gilmour, Bishop,Menzies,Simpson

marionbe
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:15 pm
Location: west lothian

drowning at sea

Post by marionbe » Sat Sep 27, 2008 7:38 pm

Hi Sarah,

It can't be her in the 1881 census as it states her age to be 62. On her death certificate it says that she was 60 years old when she died in 1887.
Even though the address is nearly similar on her certificate it was Allanpark Street and not Allanpark Place, its very confusing, what do you think.

Marion
Gilmour, Bishop,Menzies,Simpson

SarahND
Site Admin
Posts: 5631
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2006 12:47 am
Location: France

Post by SarahND » Sat Sep 27, 2008 7:50 pm

Hi Marion,
I wouldn't base anything on the ages given in the census-- they are often way off. She has a son Charles more or less the correct age and occupation. There are just not that many Charles Mowets around... I do think it's them.

Regards,
Sarah

marionbe
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:15 pm
Location: west lothian

drowning at sea

Post by marionbe » Sat Sep 27, 2008 9:24 pm

Hi Sarah,

Yes I have looked at it again and I think you are right, but where would her husband have been if he was not on the census and their daughter was not on the census as well.

Marion
Gilmour, Bishop,Menzies,Simpson

marionbe
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:15 pm
Location: west lothian

drowning at sea

Post by marionbe » Sat Sep 27, 2008 9:31 pm

Hi Sarah,

Sorry that last email was wrong Jane Mowat's daughter Jane would have been 34 years old and she was married and staying in armadale at that time, so I take it that the father Charles Mowat would have died before 1881, do you think that would be right, and on the census it would have just been the mother (jane Mowat and the younger son Charles Mowat that stayed there at that time.

Marion
Gilmour, Bishop,Menzies,Simpson

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