Birth details wanted on Jessie GARDNER (nee RUSSELL).....

[nelmit]

Hello,

Hopefully looking at James and Janet's marriage entry, on Scotlands People, will clarify her parents' names. (note the spelling of his surname)

JAMES GARDINER
Male Family

Marriages:
Spouse: JANET RUSSELL
Marriage: 04 FEB 1857 Bothwell, Lanark, Scotland

Then again - there appears to be another couple with the same names.

JAMES GARDNER
Male

Marriages:
Spouse: JANET RUSSELL
Marriage: MAY 1849 New Monkland, Lanark, Scotland

Kind regards,
Annette M

[Jack]

Hi folks,
These census indexes aren't helping any with Janet RUSSELL's birth date.
But they look like the couple married in May 1849 that you found Annette.
This is very like the family you have in 1881 Polly.
It appears daur Janet RUSSELL 5yrs was born 1855.
Seems there's a few LDS submissions for this family.
--
1851 census 651 (644) Ed 17 p 8 (New Monkland)
James GARDNER 30, b Slamannan, STI
Janet (RUSSELL) 27, b New Monkland, LKS
Male Child GARDNER, 1, b New Monkland, LKS
Jean RUSSELL, 24, b Whitburn, Linlithgow
--
1861 census 625-2 Ed 14 p 16 (Bothwell)
James GARDNER 39, b Slamannanshire
Janet GARDNER 38, b Airdrie, LKS
Marion GARDNER 15, b Dunbartonshire
David GARDNER 11, b Bothwell, LKS
Jane GARDNER 9, b Bothwell, LKS
James GARDNER 7, b Bothwell, LKS
Janet GARDNER 5, b Bothwell, LKS [1855 BC]
Alexander GARDNER 4, b Bothwell, LKS
Elizabeth GARDNER abt 1, b Bothwell, LKS

[Marion 15yrs is possibly Janet's daur before her marriage...?
or was James previously married...?]
--
Jack
ps, just before James GARDNER in 1851 is an Alexander GARDNER.
Could well be just a coincidence that,
living with James GARDNER is a Jean RUSSELL born Whitburn,
and Alexander GARDNER has an Alexander RUSSELL born Whitburn.
--
1851 census 651 (644) Ed 17 p 7 (New Monkland)
Alexander GARDNER 42, b Muiravonside, STI
Jean GARDNER 32, b Slamannan, STI [m.s. is MARSHALL]
David GARDNER 8, b New Monkland, LKS
Jean GARDNER 5, b New Monkland, LKS
Eliza GARDNER 3, b New Monkland, LKS
Alexander RUSSELL, 20, b Whitburn, Linlithgow
--

[prettypolly]

Hello Jack, Nelmit, Jean Jeanie, Lesley and Tom - Thank you all for your input. I feel quite overwhelmed with all the information provided.
Russell, I only have a copy of the death certificate of Jessie. I would once again stress that on this certificate it states Jessie was 63 years when she died and that was on 26.05.1881. Her widow James GARDNER was a Joiner/Master. She died at 29 Hallcraig Street, Airdrie. Her father was Alexander RUSSELL (handloom weaver) (deceased) and her mother Marion RUSSELL (ms. LAIDLAW) (deceased). Her death was certified by Hugh Arthur. Her son James GARDNER was present. Death registered 30.05.1881. This of course makes her date of birth around 1818 which does not match with the Janet on the 1861 census 625-2 Ed 14 pg (Bothwell). Her daughter Marion Laidlaw GARDNER who was married to Alexander Hamilton THOMSON is shown on their 1881 census as being born in Cumbernauld, Stirling. She was actually born on 28.11.1845 - that was the day her birthday was alway celebrated I have been told. On the 1881 census of 29 Hallcraig Street, Airdrie, Jessie's name is quoted as Jessie - not Janet. Also I note in the 1881 census of Hallcraig Street, Jane's birth is said to be - Old Monkland, James - Old Monkland and Janet - Airdrie.

It is interesting to note your theory of Marion GARDNER as mentioned in the 1861 census as possibly being "Janet's" daughter before her marriage and the possibility of James being previously married.`

Thank you for your interest. Prettypolly.

[Jack]

Hi Polly,
If i could go over a few things.
As previously mentioned Janet & Jessie are very much interchangeable.
(my own granny has Janet on her BC, but throughout her life was known as Jessie)
--
As Jean said, the 9th March 1855 BC of daur Janet GARDNER could be well worth getting.
This should give both her parents' ages & where born, and their marriage date & place.
And how many previous children mother Janet has had.
--
Names & Ages on Censuses & DCs aren't always exact, and a few years out isn't unusual.
I'm 99% sure that the Janet in 1851 & 1861 is your Jessie in 1881.
It's difficult to ignore that the names & ages of the children in 1861 are a very good match for 1881,
and coupled with the fact that their mother was a Janet / Jessie of abt the right age and birthplace.
I know in 1861 that all their birthplaces are as Bothwell, but errors do sometimes occur.
Bothwell is only abt 3 miles south west of Airdrie.

In 1861 [at Bothwell]
Jane 9, b Bothwell
James 7, b Bothwell
Janet 5, b Bothwell
Elizabeth 1, b Bothwell

In 1881 [at Airdrie, New Monkland]
Jane 28, b Old Monkland
James 26, b Old Monkland
Janet 24, b Airdrie
Elizabeth 21, b Bothwell

Do you have Jessie & family in 1871? Hopefully with hubby James.
--
Re Marion (GARDNER) THOMSON's birthplace in the 1881 census.
I've seen a number of folk as born Cumbernauld, Stirlingshire,
but the vast majority were as Cumbernauld, Dunbartonshire.
Maybe a small part of Cumbernauld overlapped into Stirlingshire?
All the gazetteers i've looked at (from 1842 to present day) say Cumbernauld is in Dunbartonshire.

And it might be interesting to see who Marion was living with in the 1851 census...and under what surname.
Just guessing - maybe she is with her RUSSELL gr-parents?
Or if Marion IS a daur of James GARDNER, then with his parents?
Or maybe some other relative?
--
The IGI has a number of children for James GARDNER & Janet RUSSELL.
Some are LDS Submissions, and i presume you know of these births?

DAVID GARDNER - Birth: 06 DEC 1849; Christening: 03 FEB 1850 New Monkland, Lanark, Scotland [submission]
JANE GARDNER - Christening: 15 JUN 1851 Free High Church, Airdrie, Lanark, Scotland [extract]
JAMES - born abt 1853 [can't see him in the IGI]
JANET GARDNER - Birth: 09 MAR 1855 New Monkland; Christening: 13 MAY 1855 Free High Church, Airdrie, Lanark, Scotland [extract]
ALEXANDER GARDNER - Birth: 09 APR 1857 New Monkland, Lanark, Scotland [extract]
ELIZABETH GARDNER - Birth: 20 AUG 1859 Bothwell, Lanark, Scotland [extract]
---
Jack

[prettypolly]

Hello Jack, Thank you for all your patience and perseverance with me. I will do as you suggest and obtain Janet's BC of 9.03.1855.
No - I do not have information on the abode of of Jessie and family in 1871. I have looked on and of at the Family Search and have come across certain birth dates and have kept them aside - wondering about them. Thank you for your suggestions regarding Marion's abode, etc. in 1851.

I appreciate the trouble everyone has gone to - to assist me.

Prettypolly

[isobelc]

Hi,

Haven't found her birthdate but have found two siblings.

(1) Marion Connacher m/s Russell died at Main Street Cumbernauld on 7th April 1887 aged 71. Married to Thomas Connacher,Cotton Weaver. Parents Alexander Russell, Weaver dec'd and Marion Russell m/s Laidlaw. Informant Thomas Connacher, Husband

Here they are on the 1881 census -
Dwelling: Main Street
Census Place: Cumbernauld, Dumbarton, Scotland
Source: FHL Film 0203548 GRO Ref Volume 495 EnumDist 8 Page 13
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
Thomas CONNACHER M 67 M Cumbernauld, Dunbarton, Scotland
Rel: Head
Occ: Cotton Weaver
Marion CONNACHER M 64 F Airdrie, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Wife
Occ: Cotton Winder

(2) Thomas Russell died 20/6/1882 at Wynd, Cumbernauld. Age 68, occ. Weaver married to Elizabeth Connacher.Father Alexander Russell, Weaver dec'd Mother Marion Laidlaw. Informant Robert Russell, son.

Here is their 1881 census entry- Dwelling: Wynd East Side
Census Place: Cumbernauld, Dumbarton, Scotland
Source: FHL Film 0203548 GRO Ref Volume 495 EnumDist 9 Page 4
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
Thomas RUSSELL M 66 M N Monkland, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Head
Occ: Cotton Weaver
Elizabeth RUSSELL M 60 F Cumbernauld, Dunbarton, Scotland
Rel: Wife
David RUSSELL U 35 M Cumbernauld, Dunbarton, Scotland
Rel: Son
Occ: General Labourer

Like Jessie, their births seem also not to have been recorded.

I got on their trail after noticing the birth of a Marion Laidley Russell in Cumbernauld in 1850 to Thomas Russell and Elizabeth Connacher. Seemed like too much of a coincidence to ignore. Then found the marriage of Marion Russell to Thomas Connacher in Cumbernauld and thought that was worth following up as well.

Hope this helps,
Isobel (Edinburgh)

[Jean Jeanie]

Hi Polly

Please let us know the outcome of the 1855 b.c.

We love a happy ending

Jean

[prettypolly]

Thank you Isobel for following the trail of Marion Laidley RUSSELL in Cumbernauld to Thomas RUSSELL and Elizabeth CONNACHER. This is all very exciting information. I appreciate your taking an interest in my query. I had noticed a possible connection with the CONNACHERS only recently but I was "biding" my time until I could gather some information of substance. Interesting to note the marrying of brothers and sisters in both families? Your message Isobel certainly has certainly widened my horizons....

And Jean Jeanie, I will certainly let you know of the outcome of the 1855 b.c. Thank you. Prettypolly.

[Jack]

Hi Polly,
I had to go up to Glasgow this afternoon, and as i can't manage to The Mitchell Library
for a few weeks i made a quick visit on the way back to look at those censuses.
And sorry! for some reason i missed wee Marion in the 1851 name index.
Her inclusion now explains things somewhat....
--
1851 census 651 (644) Ed 17 p 8 (New Monkland)
Gardner's Land, Clarkston. [schedule 23]
James GARDNER, head, marr, 30, joiner, b Slamannan, STI
Janet RUSSELL, wife, marr, 27, ------------b New Monkland, LKS
Marion LIDDELL, daur to wife, 6, scholar, b Cumbernauld, STI
Dv? GARDNER, son, 1, -------------------b New Monkland, LKS
Jean RUSSELL, visitor, u/m 24, lace worker, b Whitburn, Linlithgowshire
--
1851 census 651 (644) Ed 17 p 7 (New Monkland)
Alex. Gardner's Land, Clarkston. [schedule 20]
Alex. GARDNER, head, marr, 42, master joiner, b Muiravonside, STI
Jean GARDNER, wife, marr, 32, -------------------b Slamannan, STI
David GARDNER, son, 8, scholar, b New Monkland, LKS
Jean GARDNER, daur, 5, scholar, b New Monkland, LKS
Eliza GARDNER, daur, 3, ---------- b New Monkland, LKS
Alex. RUSSELL, servant, u/m 20, apprentice, b Whitburn, Linlithgowshire
Jean HENDERSON, servant, 15, house servant, b Lockerby, DFS
--
I'll be rather surprised if James isn't related in some way to Alexander.
And exactly who are Jean RUSSELL 24 and Alexander RUSSELL 20?
Are they related to Janet? or just quite a coincidence on the name?
--
Jack

[prettypolly]

As a followup on the birth of Janet GARDNER on 9 March 1855. Janet was born in 18 Clark Street, Airdrie to parents Janet GARDNER (nee RUSSELL) (29 yr) of Whitburn (her 5th child) and James GARDNER (36yr) of Slamannan. Janet G and James G were married Clarkston 1849. At time of birth there were 2 boys and 2 girls alive.With regard to the age of Jessie/Janet GARDNER on her death certificate, it states she was 63 but this was most likely a mistake and should have been 53.

Jack, the information you supplied on the 1851 census that Marion's surname was LIDDELL is of great interest to me.

Best wishes - Prettypolly