William Paterson born 1867.....

ninatoo · Post by **ninatoo** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 1:05 am

Hi all,

Another little mystery to solve, and I am not finding this one easy, particularly with such a name as William Paterson.

I have him as being born abourt 1866-67, the 1891 and the 1901 censuses both say at Possilpark Renfrew. His marriage registration in 1888 to Prudence McGinlay has his father William Paterson as "Reputed Father". His mother is listed as Euphemia Melville, and it seems she did not marry William, but had later married someone called Davison (hard to read, but it is the only one close enough according to marriages for Euphemia at SP).

The problem is that at the IGI I cannot find a William Paterson born to these parents, or to just Euphemia in Renfrew, although there are two listed to Euphemia's in all counties, both call themselves Paterson. I did not look at these certificates at SP yet. (Don't want to waste too many credits at present). In any case, is it likely that the father is named on these certificates, when it is not listed at IGI?

How can I get any further? Any ideas?

Nina

JustJean · Post by **JustJean** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 2:50 am

Hi Nina

Little mystery solved! First off you can't believe everything you read on Marriage Certs! But you were on the right trail. I think you had the right MC from SP as you said you found one for Euphemia to a Davison. Bingo!! Search for her DC using maiden and married names and allowing wildcards and her maiden name turns from Melville...to Melvin!!! And her husband has a wonderfully unique name of Maxwell and her daugher Mary is the informant.

Now a quick trawl though the 1881 census and here you find a new name for her....Fanny

....

Dwelling: 56 Herriet Street
Census Place: Eastwood, Renfrew, Scotland
Source: FHL Film 0203568 GRO Ref Volume 562 EnumDist 10 Page 5
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
Maxwell DAVIDSON M 48 M Ireland
Rel: Head
Occ: Freestone Quarrier
Fanny DAVIDSON M 45 F Govan, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Wife
Mary DAVIDSON 11 F Pollokshaws, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Daur
Occ: Scholar

but using the newfound MELVIN clue you can quickly search for William in 1881 (illegitimates have the habit of acquiring their father's surnames when they grow older but being registered under their single mum's at birth)

Institution: "Industrial School" Albion St
Census Place: Paisley Middle Church, Renfrew, Scotland
Source: FHL Film 0203583 GRO Ref Volume 573 EnumDist 45 Page 17
Marr Age Sex Birthplace
Margt. MARTIN 13 F Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Janet MARTIN 11 F Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
James SCOTT 13 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
John DUNCAN 15 M Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Jas. BECKETT 14 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Wm. YOUNG 13 M Pollokshaws, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Wm.P. MELVIN 13 M Pollokshaws, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Janet RAMSAY 15 F Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
James GIBSON 14 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Geo. FRASER 11 M
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
W.F. FREIKLETON 13 M Edinburgh, Edinburgh, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
James GARVIN 15 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Robt. MC CONNACHIE 13 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Jane HUTCHESON 13 F Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Elizth. WEST 14 F Glasgow, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Wm. REDDY 13 M Ireland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Anthony REDDY 10 M Gibraltar
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Margt. NEALY 10 F Coatbridge, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Alex. MC ALLISTER 14 M Airdrie, Lanark, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Ann CAMPBELL 12 F Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Geo. ROBERTSON 15 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Wm. EDMISTON 15 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Joseph ADAM 11 M Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Elizabeth TURBURN 10 F Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar
Cath. PEUGH 14 F Paisley, Renfrew, Scotland
Rel: Inmate
Occ: Scholar

and finally from the IGI...

1. WILLIAM PATERSON MELVIN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 30 JUL 1867 Eastwood, Renfrew, Scotland

and just for the record....Mary wisnae a Davison either....

1. MARY MELVIN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 05 SEP 1869 Eastwood, Renfrew, Scotland

Best wishes
Jean

ninatoo · Post by **ninatoo** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 3:03 am

Jean!! You are awesome!!!

I have been trying all sorts of things for three hours...and you have done it in less than one!

THANK YOU!!!!

Now, how to tell the living rellies that their very own family name is merely a 'reputed' one?

I will get those certificates before I think more about that.....oh THANKS Jean!!! Much appreciated!

Nina

mallog · Post by **mallog** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 8:34 am

Jean

That was a masterclass for folk like me. I have just recently realised there's more to wildcards than filling in missing letters etc but I have still got a long way to go when looking for those elusive records. Ta

Mallog

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 9:54 am

mallog wrote:Jean

That was a masterclass for folk like me. I have just recently realised there's more to wildcards than filling in missing letters etc ....snipped......Mallog

Precisely

Wildcards are only a tool, - a very useful and extremely valuable tool, - but they're not a magic wand, and can't substitute for the type of search that Jean carried out.

As is so often the case when a record can't be found the solution is to forget that particular record for the moment, and go look for whatever else can be found that might clarify the situation, - in this case a death register entry, and the 1881 census entry.

The 1867 birth register entry only has Euphemia's mark, so that Euphemia probably couldn't check what had been written, so that it's always possible that the register misheard MELVILLE as MELVIN, there being many more of the former than the latter.

MELVILLE appears on William's marriage register entry, but MELVIN appears on Euphemia's death register entry, - informant daughter Mary SMITH, whose own birth register entry also shows the surname as MELVIN. It could have been interesting to have a look at Mary's marriage register entry to Mr SMITH, but there's only one Scottish record of a marriage between any MELV* and a SM?TH*, and that's for a Jessie with different parents, so either it was an irregular marriage, or she wasn't using the surname MELVIN.

Tentative conclusion?, - something went wrong somewhere in the process of the completion of the marriage schedule and the transcription of the information into the register book of marriages

David

PS Nor is there a matching Mary DAVI*SON/SM?TH* marriage except for a possible Service and War Returns record in 1893, for which there is, as yet, no image on line........
dww

ninatoo · Post by **ninatoo** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:33 am

No David,

Mary Melvin/lle married under the surname Paterson!!! I found the family on the 1871 census and baby Mary was listed under Paterson, so I searched for that, and got a hit. She married James Smith. Mother listed as Melvin. Mary the daughter, at least, was under the impression that the mother's surname was Melvin.

Mary Melvin/lle the mother married Maxwell Davison using Melville, and when Maxwell died, she was also listed as Melville, although it was a clerk at the Abbey Asylum that was informant.

So it seems to me she was probably more likely to be a Melville, but then who can know for sure, since there is no birth record at IGI where I can check. Her parents were James Melvin/lle and Mary Leitch according to her marriage registration to Maxwell. No kids for them at all, nor a marriage.

I don't suppose I will ever find the correct William Paterson who was the reputed father of these children, unless someone can come up with as brilliant a method of deduction as already displayed by Jean?

LesleyB · Post by **LesleyB** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 12:23 pm

Hi Nina

I don't suppose I will ever find the correct William Paterson who was the reputed father of these children,

....Unless at some point she applied for poor relief and the appliation has survived and gives some detail - Jack (& Annette) found a father, and his occupation, for one of my lot. See:
http://talkingscot.com/forum/viewtopic. ... ight=crout

So that might be worth following up just in case. Don't know about the status of Refrew /Paisley Poor Accounts, but it will be mentioned somehwere on this site!

best wishes
Lesley

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 12:48 pm

I did say tentative

, and the 1871 census does show her as MELVIN

Who knows ?

But where is she in the earlier censuses ?

Lesley's suggestion re the poor relief records is worthwhile following up.

It might also be worth a look in the Eastwood kirk session records, but the problem could be that there will be a choice of churches ............

David

ninatoo · Post by **ninatoo** » Mon Apr 24, 2006 11:53 pm

Yes David, I can't find her on earlier censuses either, at least in the correct vicinity. I see a couple of Euphemias elsewhere in the 1861, but haven't checked them out yet. One was Perth and the other was I think Kirkentilloch...can't recall for sure. Both were about 20 years old. I then became tired and broke, so had to stop! I haven't looked at the 1851 or 1841 yet. Was hoping that William Paterson the reputed father might have been a neighbour or something!

Just had a thought...William must have been nearby tp Pollockshaws in 1869, as that is when baby Mary was born (that is if he WAS the father). Maybe he was still moping around in the background in 1871....

Needs more research!

Nina

Jack · Post by **Jack** » Sun Jul 02, 2006 7:10 am

Hi Nina,
Came across this short application for Euphemia MELVIN hidden in one of my paper mountains....

Sadly no mention of a William Paterson, and any letters mentioned in applications, to my knowledge, haven't survived.
Jack
===================================
Govan Poor Relief Application. D.HEW. 17 / 431 (2). Page 91. N° 27613.
Applied 11.10am, 5 Oct 1897.
Euphemia Melvin or Davidson.
7 Hamilton St, Polmadie. Low left (Smith).
Age 66, born Pollokshaws.
Parents - James Melvin, carter & Mary Leech, both dead.
Protestant.
Widow.
Housewife.
Wholly disabled.
Family with -
Mary 27 (illeg), born Pollokshaws, wife of James Smith, miner, 4 children.
Family not with -
Husband Maxwell Davidson, quarryman, dead, born Ireland.
William 29 (illeg), born Pollokshaws, married, millworker in Bridgeton.
1st application.
Other information -
Eastwood pauper paid up till 6th.
See letter 34101.
----
Asst. Inspector's report - 6 Oct 1897.
Euphemia Melvin or Davidson.
7 Hamilton st, Polmadie, low left, c/o Smith.
Age 66yrs, born Pollokshaws
Protestant.
Widow, housewife.
Daur of James Melvin, carter & Mary Leech, both dead.
Husband Maxwell Davidson, dead, born Ireland.
Family -
William 29 (illeg), born Pollokshaws, married, mill worker. Resides in Bridgeton.
Mary 27 (illeg), born Pollokshaws, wife of James Smith, miner, 4 chn, with whom applicant resides.
Settlement - "Eastwood". See letter from Eastwood N° 34101.
Certified - Hemiplegia. (cert. J.V. Wallace, medical officer).
Applies for Relief.
John H. Balfour. Asst. Inspector.
21 Dec 1897; 7/- per week. Report.
18 Jan 1898; 3/6 per week. Report, 11 Jan 1898.
31 June 1898; Off Roll, left parish. Report, 1 Aug 1898.
============================================end

TalkingScot.com

William Paterson born 1867.....

William Paterson born 1867.....

Euphemia Melvin - Poor Relief 1897