Another deciphering challenge.....

MadMac · Post by **MadMac** » Sat May 06, 2006 4:39 am

http://talkingscot.com/gallery/displayi ... p?pos=-527

New here, and hoping someone can solve a mystery. This is the entry for the marriage of my grandmother's sister Mary Robertson. Mary's mother is listed as an Elizabeth Robertson, maiden surname "Mannon". This makes no sense whatsoever in the overall context of my family research. Additionally, there is no trace of an Elizabeth Robertson with a maiden surname anything like this having died between Mary's birth in 1899 and her marriage in 1922. Am I reading the surname correctly? Open to any and all suggestions.

Post by **Tracey** » Sat May 06, 2006 6:28 am

Hello MadMac

Welcome to TS

I am reading the same as you for the sir name but possibly with an a Mannan.
Do you have John and Elizabeths marriage certificate ? any clues on that re witnesses etc ? You have Mary's birth certificate ? out of interest what is her mothers maiden name ?

Tracey

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Sat May 06, 2006 9:18 am

There's a 1917 death of an Elizabeth ROBERSTON, MS MADDEN, but the husband's occupation doesn't match ................

David

JimM · Post by **JimM** » Sat May 06, 2006 10:06 am

Could it be Manson?

Jim

JustJean · Post by **JustJean** » Sat May 06, 2006 12:33 pm

Hi MadMac

My suspicion is that they listed the wrong mother!! I'm guessing that it could be Mary's grandmother's name...or at least something like it

Look for the death of John Robertson in Dalziel. Yeah I know there are several...but only one in 1928. He's a widower and his wife was an Agnes. Son was informant. Coal miner. Mother was an Elizabeth MORLAND. See if any of that fits your puzzle....

Best wishes
Jean

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Sat May 06, 2006 1:38 pm

JustJean wrote:Hi MadMac

My suspicion is that they listed the wrong mother!! I'm guessing that it could be Mary's grandmother's name...or at least something like it Look for the death of John Robertson in Dalziel. Yeah I know there are several...but only one in 1928. He's a widower and his wife was an Agnes. Son was informant. Coal miner. Mother was an Elizabeth MORLAND. See if any of that fits your puzzle....

Best wishes
Jean

I saw that one as well and wondered............

Remember that the registration of a death happened at a very, possibly exceedingly, stressful time, and it's far from uncommon for the resultant emotional stresses to lead to error(s), over and above situations where there is genuine doubt over the correct information, or just plain lack of knowledge, and a bit of guesswork comes into play, with the registrar not being aware of this ............

David

JustJean · Post by **JustJean** » Sat May 06, 2006 2:10 pm

Considering that the John and Agnes family in 1901 Dalziel did have a wee Mary age 2 then I'm sticking with my first guess.

Interesting to note though

Agnes seems to not be in the family in 1901 but John's mother is......but where was Agnes???? She didnae pass on til 1921!!! But she was the mother of Mary b. 1899 in Dalziel. How interesting!!

Best wishes
Jean

MadMac · Post by **MadMac** » Sat May 06, 2006 6:07 pm

To answer the various questions here.....

Tracey - Yes, I have their marriage entry, John Robertson and Agnes Bole married in 1884. They are listed as Mary's parents on her birth entry.

David - I saw that one, but I'm sure there's no connection there. Strange thing is, the erroneous listing is on Mary's marriage certificate. Also, her mother (Agnes) had died the previous year in the same house Mary got married out of. Elizabeth Robertson (Mary's Grandmother) died in 1901. Funny thing is, she was apparently 72 at the time of the census, but 75 when she died that December! (If her metabolism was like that, it's surprising she lasted that long.....)

Jim - I saw the Mansons when I was searching, they all appear to be in the North, again no obvious connection.

Jean - That John Robertson is Mary's father (my Great-Grandfather). As to your query about the 1901 census, that threw me for a while too. Their entry was spread over two pages - if you look above the names at the top of the page, you'll see something that looks like "Cont'd" (short for "Continued"). John, Agnes and Catherine (daughter born in 1884 - my Granny had already left the house at that time, she was 19) are at the bottom of the previous page.

I'm inclined to put this one down to a clerical error, as I am in no doubt whatsoever that Mary and my Granny were sisters. Two of Mary's daughters are still alive in their late 70s, I think a couple of phone calls will definitely solve this.

Russell · Post by **Russell** » Sat May 06, 2006 6:48 pm

I know this is probably way off beam but could the name be MANNERS

there were a few of them about in Scotland -

Census 1891 108
Census 1901 105
Statutory Register Births 1889 - 1905 24
Statutory Register Marriages / Banns 1889 - 1922 44
Statutory Register Deaths 1889 - 1922 61
Wills & Testaments 1889 - 1901 2

Russell

JustJean · Post by **JustJean** » Sun May 07, 2006 12:21 am

Hi MadMax

Wow...I did see that notation above John's name on the census but didn't think it looked like con't so didn't bother to go back a page as usually the head is always named first!

Guess there is an exception to every rule!! I'm wondering if Moreland spoken with an Irish influenced accent would sound anything like Mannon??? Afterall Elizabeth was born in Ireland so John and family might have kept some of the pronunciations. Or maybe Mary just misunderstood the question and thought they wanted her father's mother's name.....or maybe the registrar was a wee bit off on his hearing! Did you check for marriages of all the other siblings and did any of them make the same error?

Best wishes
Jean