Help with deciphering medical terms on 1870 DC

lpearce · Post by **lpearce** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 7:33 pm

I have posted an image in the gallery of part of the death certificate showing the cause of death of our ggrandad David Todd, in 1870 Edinburgh.
Are there any medics out there who can read and let us know the likely cause of death. He was a house painter by trade.
http://talkingscot.com/gallery/displayi ... ?pos=-1258
Any help would be appreciated
Thanks
Les

Link not working and edited 9:52 GMT +5 June 16 by Paddyscar

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 7:58 pm

Not easy !!!

Wound of Cursa ......
Knee Joint 7 days
Phlymenous
Crysopolas 3 days
Encephalitis 2 days
As cert by James S
Cameron M.D(?).

David

Isabel H · Post by **Isabel H** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 8:14 pm

Wound of bursa _
knee joint 7 days
Phlegmenous Erysipelas 3 days
Encephalitis 2 days
as certified by _ Cameron M.D.

Seems to have been bacterial infection of a wound.

DavidWW · Post by **DavidWW** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 9:23 pm

See http://endaye.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erysipelas

Not nice !!

Plus http://www.kidshealth.org/parent/infect ... litis.html

Bursa is defined at http://www.answers.com/topic/bursa , plus see also http://www.medterms.com/script/main/art ... lekey=4115

Appears to be have been an infected wound on his knee, which spread to other parts of his body, - all this in the days well before modern antibiotics.............

David

lpearce · Post by **lpearce** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 10:01 pm

This is really useful I have little medical knowledge so found it near impossible to make out the words.
Do you think the Knee injury developed into Phlegmenous Erysipelas and this infection spread to his brain causing death by Encephalitis?

The family have various stories of what happened before entering hospital.
He ran a house painting company and the favorite is that he was on the way from the bank with the workers wages when he was robbed, while others say maybe he fell of a ladder.
This does not answer that but at least gets a little nearer

Thanks
Les

Isabel H · Post by **Isabel H** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 10:21 pm

Do you think the Knee injury developed into Phlegmenous Erysipelas and this infection spread to his brain causing death by Encephalitis?

I don't have any medical knowledge either but it seems more than likely.
Isabel

Post by **paddyscar** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 3:50 am

You're all on track as the following sites show.

http://www.antiquusmorbus.com/English
http://www.paul_smith.doctors.org.uk/ArchaicMedicalTerms.htm
http://www.merck.com

We do know that when Russell logs on, he'll be able to put it in much easier terms though.

Frances

Russell · Post by **Russell** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 11:40 am

Hi Frances
And thanks! You think I'm so old that I remember all these ancient medical terms

When I looked at the cause of death my first thought was -he was lucky it wasn't gas gangrene.
Pre anti-biotics there was little they could do when a wound infection was transported to other parts of the body via the blood stream. Normally the lymphatic system filters the bacteria out of the blood stream. In the old days it was fairly common to see a fiery red line running up an arm or leg showing the presence of infection in the lymph vessels.
Phlegm was considered one of the bodily humours and Erysipilis was a bacterial skin infection which, in this case, had caused eruptions all over the body. It modern terms it was more likely to be called Septicaemia.
His Encephalitis would probably be diagnosed now as Bacterial Meningitis which would be almost inevitable because of his Septicaemia.
Not a pleasant way to go.

Even today with all our modern techniques and resources this could still happen particularly with drug resistant micro-organisms.

I was fascinated by the person registering the death
I was born in Ormiston village which is just a few miles up-country from Gullane and as a child, I was one of the first people in the village to be treated with Penicillin at the tail end of the war.

Russell
P.S. some of that certificate was just awful to read - cheap, diluted ink !

Post by **paddyscar** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 5:08 pm

That wasn't my intimation at all, Russell

... but if you feel the need to make YOUR age an issue ....

On my part, when I start stringing a series of medical definitions together, I often get lost. I was simply highlighting the likelihood that your career and knowledge of medicine, would enlighten us further. AND you lived up to my expectation

On the issue of YOUR age, I say nothing. I, however, was not born until many years after the war (WWII)

Frances

lpearce · Post by **lpearce** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 6:44 pm

Russell
Thanks for the medical explanation, it seems a terrible way to go he was only 28 years old.

The witness Peter Ormiston was born in Edinburgh according to the census, but between 1861 and 1881 lived at Ormiston Place, Dirleton, East Lothian, Scotland. In the 1851-61 census he is in Brown Street, Glasgow
I also have been wondering if there is a connection with Ormiston village, I am at present trying to trace his parent that may help

Les