THOMAS DOUGLAS b c 1806 Erroll Perth

[kenspeckle]

this is the biggest brick wall for me I would very much like to know who his parents were I have not been able to find a birth in any of the years around 1806 and nothing at all for Erroll... I have found a few more births for DOUGLAS family in ERROL around that period but that would only be a guess that they may be his same parents all to a JOHN DOUGLAS and MARY WATT

The info I have on THOMAS DOUGLAS so far is
his marriage married 1861
08/04/1846 MCKINLAY EUPHEMIA THOMAS DOUGLAS/FR2377 U ST CUTHBERT'S
EDINBURGH 685/02 0046 no parents names just of this parish
census
from 1851 census
Edinburgh says age 45 he was a spirit merchant at 88 Nicholson Street born Errol Perth
he was also in trade directories 1846-1858 as a spirit merchant
they had 5 daughters the first there is no birth record for Euphemia b 1845 only info on her is from census
my cousin got info from a man in Scotland ??? that THOMAS DOUGLAS died 17 Aug 1852 of a stomach complaint and was buried in the Newington Cemetery Dalkeith Road, Edinburgh
however he is not on the Newington Cemetery CD which I bought so I have no idea if this info was correct as she was a bit vague about who it was told her he may have got it from the lair registers but I believe thats a job and a half and can only be done in person and may not even say who his father was
1861 his Widow Euphemia was at address 35 Jamaica St Edinburgh she then remarried a John Manworth Wilson born N.Y. and sailed for Australia
the daughters below and looking for clues in their middle names I got nothing positive
Euphemia Douglas 1845 born out of wedlock and may not even have been his child ?
Jessie Scott Douglas 1847
Mary Ann McKinlay Douglas (Her mother's maiden name) 1848
Elizabeth Mansfield Douglas (The only Mansfield in Edinburgh was a accountant ?) 1850
Agnes McPherson Douglas 1851

I would very much appreciate any advice on this Thomas on where else I could look for his birth or maybe I will never find him ?

[AndrewP]

Hi kenspeckle,

The cemetery records for Newington Cemetery should be at the City of Edinburgh Council's Cemetery Records Office at the following address.

Cemetery Records Office
Mortonhall Cemetery & Crematorium
Howdenhall Rd
Edinburgh
EH16 6TX

Tel. 0131 664 4314
Fax. 0131 664 2031

If you tell them that THOMAS DOUGLAS was buried in Newington Cemetery in 1852, and ask them for all the information they hold about that burial and any others buried in that lair. Assuming the records they have go back as far as 1852 then they should at least be able to confirm if that burial did take place there and then, and hopefully have some more information for you.

The Cemetery Records Office is a small place with not many staff. They are also busy with the day to day admin of the crematorium and cemetery there, so a reply may not come back right away.

All the best,

AndrewP

[kenspeckle]

Hi Andrew I will give it a go

Newington according to cd was opened in 1846 and Mortonhall holds the records except for the ones 1931 -1990 were lost by previous owners but says only by appointment for 2 hour periods to view the lair record and sale books and that staff are busy as you say in running crematorium business . I suppose that some families may have bought a lair in 1846 but not used it till years later which would make it tricky to find details but TD dying in 1852 and the daughter Elizabeth in 1851 keeps it much narrower field
So I will jot a wee letter to them and keeps fingers crossed
best regards lesley

[kenspeckle]

Hah just noticed that you are in Old Reekie ! my Gran Wilkie lived at 16 Grindlay St
I spent a lot of my childhood there ..... I love Edinburgh

[nelmit]

Probably nothing to do with your Thomas but I thought I'd post this anyway.
There is this marriage in Perth but no son Thomas although plenty of gaps for him to fill.

JANET SCOTT Female

Marriages:
Spouse: DOND. DOUGLASS
Marriage: 13 NOV 1802 Dull, Perth, Scotland


Results for: Father: Dond Douglas, Mother: Janet Scott
Exact Spelling: Off

1. ISABEL DOUGLAS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 17 OCT 1813 Logierait, Perth, Scotland

2. JOHN DOUGLAS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 14 AUG 1816 Moulin, Perth, Scotland

3. MARGARET DOUGLAS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 18 NOV 1810 Moulin, Perth, Scotland

4. JANET DOUGLAS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 15 SEP 1822 Moulin, Perth, Scotland

5. CATH. DOUGLASS - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 22 FEB 1804 Dull, Perth, Scotland

I assume his age from the 1841 at FREECEN has been mistranscribed.

DOUGLAS Thomas M 22 Shopman Spirit Dealer Outside Census County (1841)

Regards,
Annette M

[kenspeckle]

Many thanks as you never know its very possible as hardly anythng was noted for Errol and he may have been baptised in another town..

I even wondered if Thomas may have been a second name I was also looking at other Douglas from the Dull area I was wary it being so far from Errol and have been looking at all possibilities maybe going nuts but I have really found nothing at all in naming patterns for Thomas and his lot Grr

I think I found Euphemia in 1841 working as servant for Hunters in Edinburgh and the Hunters married the Muckersies in Fife and they married the McKinlays so possible he was a distant relation she was working for .... Robert Hunter her cousin also had the Leith Pottery till he went to NY when Leith Pottery business failed him 1847
I found a Sholto Douglas living across the road from Euphemia in 1861 and he was a coachman and Euphemia's sister Christian's Husband Alexander Wilkie had a Coach hire business and had a lot of coaches his sons also drove them Alexander is from Kinoull Perth they married at Craighall ......Craighall is near Rattray in Blairgowrie Perth
1861 census
Name: Sholto Douglas
Age: 44
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1817
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Isabella
Gender: Male
Where born: Foss, Perthshire
Registration Number: 685/2
Registration district: St Andrew
Civil Parish: Edinburgh St Stephen
County: Midlothian
Address: 28 Jamaica St
Occupation: Cabman
Alexander Douglas 15
Isabella Douglas 43 b Edinburgh
Isabella J Douglas 11
James Sholto Douglas 7
Jessie Douglas 20 Baker's Shop Keeper b Blair Atholl, Perthshire abt 1841
John Douglas 18
Margaret C Douglas 2 Mo b Edinburgh, Edinburghshire
Sholto Douglas 44

[mac]

Hi,

Have uplifted pic of Market Square, Errol for you! Should appear soon in gallery.

http://talkingscot.com/gallery/displayi ... ?pos=-1443

regards,

mac

Gallery URL added - AndrewP

[kenspeckle]

G,Day Mac thanks very much for the photo of Market Square Errol its lovely the place looks a lot bigger than I thought it to be
many thanks lesley in tassie

[mac]

My pleasure Lesley. Good luck with your research.

regards,

mac

[SarahND]

Hello Lesley!
Good thing you didn't try to find this family on Ancestry.com! They are indexed under "Daylor" in 1851-- took me forever to find them, and I already knew the street from your post!

88 Nicolson Street, Edinburgh St Cuthberts
Thomas Daylor, 45, Head, born Erroll, Perth, Wine Spint Agent
Euphemia Daylor, 42, Wife, born Kirkcaldy, Fife
Euphemia Daylor, 6, Daughter, born Edinr, Midlothian
Jessie Scott Daylor, 4, Daughter, born Edinr, Midlothian, At Home
Mary A M Daylor, 2, Daughter, born Edinr, Midlothian, At Home
Elizabeth M Daylor, 10 Mo, Daughter, born Edinr, Midlothian, At Home
Thomas Pencille, 81, Lodger, born Stere, Midlothian, Baren Brener Master Employing
James Pencille, 23, Lodger, born Edinr, Midlothian, Baren Brener
Margaret Griese, 20, Servant, born Edinr, Midlothian, House Servant

Did all of the daughters go to Australia with their mother and her new husband, or did any of them stay behind and marry in Scotland? I note that the oldest girl, Euphemia, is not with her mother in 1861. Did she, too, die young, or was she just working outside the home or already married?

I assume his age from the 1841 at FREECEN has been mistranscribed.

DOUGLAS Thomas M 22 Shopman Spirit Dealer Outside Census County (1841)

The Ancestry version of the 1841 has him age 27, but I would tend to trust FREECEN...

Speaking of which, I think the ages were way off in the 1851 census. Judging from the incomprehensible transcription on Ancestry, it sounds like the page may be a difficult one to read. I had thought that Euphemia was having her children a bit late for that era, and sure enough in 1861 she calls herself 39. I think it must have read 32, rather than 42 in 1851. Here is a likely birth from the IGI:

Euphemia Mac Kinlay
Birth 04 Mar 1819 Abbotshall, Fife
Father: Robert Mac Kinlay
Mother: Janet Muckarsie

Lesley, you mentioned the Muckarsies, so perhaps this is a birth you have already found?
Anyway, I have not found the birth of Thomas, which is what you actually wanted... Sorry.

All the best,
Sarah