1851 Census Dudgeon .....

[garibaldired]

Hello All,

I'm hoping for some help here!
I've uploaded an image to the gallery (awaiting approval) of the Dudgeon family in 1851 in Newbattle.
I have several problems. It's difficult to read but I'm seeing two sons called James. Do you agree?
I was actually looking for Alexander Dudgeon born Cockpen 1818, married to Elizabeth Dobbie born Lasswade 1815 in 1840 and found with a son James age 12 in 1861. I can find no trace of James' birth (it says dob was Newbattle in 1861 census) and although I can find the couple in Cranston in 1841 and the 3 of them in Newbattle in 1861 I can't find them anywhere in 1841.
I'm hoping for some expert help here!
Alexander died in August 1861 and Elizabeth in Newbattle in 1900, but there is no further trace of son James.
What do you all think?

Meg

http://talkingscot.com/gallery/displayi ... ?pos=-1092 - added DWW

[Jean Jeanie]

Hi Meg

I think the 4 year old "James" might be a Jannet!

I know it says "son" in the relationship column, but I have seen incorrect relationships many times on censuses.


Best wishes
Jean

[AndrewP]

Hi Meg,

My feeling is that the 4 year old should be John.

ScotlandsPeople indexes the family as:
JOHN, M, 35
ELIZABETH, F, 36
WILLIAM, M, 13
ELIZABETH, F, 10
JAMES, M, 8
MARION, F, 6
JAMES, M, 4
ALEXANDER, M, 0

Then on the IGI there are the following children to John Dudgeon and Elizabeth Crauford / Crawford:
WILLIAM DUDGEON - Christening: 02 DEC 1838 Newton, Midlothian
JAMES DUDGEON - Christening: 29 APR 1842 Newbattle, Midlothian
JAMES DUDGEON - Christening: 07 APR 1843 Crichton, Midlothian
MARION DUDGEON - Christening: 06 AUG 1845 Newbattle, Midlothian
John Dudgeon - Christening: 15 AUG 1847 Dalkeith, Midlothian

Looks like James of 1842 probably died within his first year and the next son took his name. Age-wise John fits the bill for being the younger James on the 1851 census page.

Does John show up later on anywhere?

All the best,

AndrewP

[garibaldired]

Thanks for adding the link, David.

I'm afraid I can't see John or Janet!
I appreciate what you're saying makes sense, Andrew but I'm not convinced! If anything I could make Samuel out of it!
But that doesn't help either.

I don't know whether John crops up later - I've rather been side-tracked with this family! I'm really looking for a James born in 1847 in Newbattle!
Well back to the drawing board and many thanks for your help, Jean and Andrew.

Best wishes,
Meg

[Jack]

Hi Meg,
Here are the same family in 1861.
--
1861 census 676 Ed 4 p 18 (Cockpen)
83 Hunterfield.
John DUDGEON, head, marr, 44, Coal Miner, b Cockpen, MLN
Elizabeth DUDGEON, wife, marr, 44, -------b Cockpen, MLN
William DUDGEON, son, 23, Coal Miner, b Newbattle, MLN
James DUDGEON, son, 19, Coal Miner, b Crichton, MLN
John DUDGEON, son, 14, Coal Miner, b Newbattle, MLN
Alexandrina DUDGEON, daur, 10, Scholar, b Newbattle, MLN
--
Is 10yr old daur Alexandrina the 4mos old son Alexander from 1851?
Jack

[Rockford]

ScotlandsPeople indexes the family as:
JOHN, M, 35
ELIZABETH, F, 36
WILLIAM, M, 13
ELIZABETH, F, 10
JAMES, M, 8
MARION, F, 6
JAMES, M, 4
ALEXANDER, M, 0

For my tuppence worth, I think that, looking at the image, SP are right and there are definitely two James' recorded. The question would then be did the enumerator make a mistake and should the younger one be John as per the 1861 Census Jack has given.

The other thing you could do is submit a contact form to SP for an unreadable image - I did this for a marriage certificate I could not read at all and they sent me a photocopy from the actual book - it was much clearer and helped a lot (at no extra cost!). This might mean you were able to make out names for sure, and also addresses and places of birth.

Best wishes

Brian

[Jack]

Hi again Meg,
This looks like Alexander & Elizabeth, but no son James.
Can't see him in 1851 - could he have been adopted?
--
1851 census 695 Ed 9 p 2 (Newbattle)
6, 1st Row, Newtongrange.
Alexander DUDGEON, head marr, 33, Collier, b Lasswade, MLN
Elizabeth DUDGEON, wife, marr, 35, ---------b Newbattle, MLN
--
Jack

[garibaldired]

Jack,

You are a star!

Looks like you've solved it. How did you find Alexander and Elizabeth in 1851? I couldn't find them at all - the only Alexander I could find now seems to be Alexandrina!!

Thanks very much for your help.
And I appreciate your input Brian. Thanks too.

Best wishes,
Meg

[garibaldired]

Jack,

Yes I am rather puzzled about "son" James. He only appears in 1861 with them and I can't find any record of his birth/baptism, marriage or death.
Perhaps he was wrongly enumerated as "son"?

Meg

[Jack]

Hi Meg,
The only reason i thought adopted was because Alexander & Elizabeth were childless in 1851.
Most couples could've had half a dozen children by then if marrying in 1840.
If they did have any children, possibly they had all died young?

Even if James was adopted i'd be surprised if his parents would be any other than Alexander & Elizabeth on his MC or DC.
This because that if he was born under another name it had been already been changed to Dudgeon.
And if adopted, it might have happened when he was a young age - so Alex & Eliz were the only parents that he'd ever known?

But as you say, maybe James wrongly enumerated as a son - name too!
Presume you can't see him in 1871?
His DC should be in the Statutory Records - ie, if he did remain in Scotland.
--
I found Alexander & Elizabeth in that excellent 1851 Midlothian census CD by The Lothians FHS.
That, and its companion, the 1841 MLN census, are the best i've used.
Just a pity they don't include Edinburgh itself....
--
Jack