naming customs and illegitimacy

[HeatherH]

In my family the illigits have the fathers surname as a middle name and 1 wee lad has 2 middle names making him much easier to sort out.
Heather

[Lorna Allison]

Hi

Just this weekend I found a young man who started his life in Kirk Yetholm Rox as William Taylor, illegitimate child then after 20 years he turns up in a retired, unmarried Woollen Manufacturers (Peter Govanlock) household as "Son, Ag Lab". Woollen man. dies 6 years later and birth reg. signed by "Peter Govanlock, Son". This Peter Govanlock, (Farmer now) dies in 1924 and his death reg. describes him as "formerly William Taylor".

Alas for old Peter Govanlock, the "son" did not marry and appears not to have had any progeny.

I am left wondering whether I can assume that this boy was in fact his son, or did he just take a liking to him in old age having spent years utilising his sisters as housekeepers? Perhaps this is another instance where Kirk Session Minutes might shed some light?

Regards

Lorna

[SarahND]

Perhaps this is another instance where Kirk Session Minutes might shed some light?

Great story, Lorna! You're in luck, those records appear to survive at NAS:

CH2 Records of Church of Scotland synods, presbyteries and kirk sessions 1569-1998
Country code: GB
Repository code:234
Repository:National Archives of Scotland
Reference: CH2/671
Title: Records of Yetholm Kirk Session
Dates: 1691-1939
Access status: Open
Level: Fonds

Let us know if you find out the truth

Regards,
Sarah

[Lorna Allison]

Will do Sarah.

I now know that William was the youngest of three illegitimate brothers all living in Kirk Yetholm with mother and grandfather. Don't know what to make of that - but this is one of those cases where an otherwise scarcely related family appears so interesting that the 'family silver' starts draining away in the direction of SP

When I got the death reg of 'old' Peter Govanlock's brother John I found on the same page the death of Charles Faa Blyth Rutherford, Gypsy King who died at the Gypsy Palace, Kirk Yetholm - all details entered on reg. I already knew that Kirk Yetholm had been a gypsy centre for 400 years and that Charles Faa Blyth was the last gypsy king, being crowned there in 1898, also that apparently Peter Govanlock had "done up" the cottage known as the Gypsy Palace. However, it was interesting that all the stories about the last King call him Charles Faa Blyth, good regal gypsy names. In fact his mother Esther was gypsy queen (with those names) but his father was a Rutherford. Posterity seems quietly to have sidelined him

Sorry to have gone off post (quite a bit) one does get carried away . . . . . . .

Regards

Lorna

[SarahND]

When I got the death reg of 'old' Peter Govanlock's brother John I found on the same page the death of Charles Faa Blyth Rutherford, Gypsy King who died at the Gypsy Palace, Kirk Yetholm - all details entered on reg.

Great stuff!!! I think we would all get carried away in the circumstances

Best wishes,
Sarah

[Montrose Budie]

Hi

Just this weekend I found a young man who started his life in Kirk Yetholm Rox as William Taylor, illegitimate child then after 20 years he turns up in a retired, unmarried Woollen Manufacturers (Peter Govanlock) household as "Son, Ag Lab". Woollen man. dies 6 years later and birth reg. signed by "Peter Govanlock, Son". This Peter Govanlock, (Farmer now) dies in 1924 and his death reg. describes him as "formerly William Taylor".

Alas for old Peter Govanlock, the "son" did not marry and appears not to have had any progeny.

I am left wondering whether I can assume that this boy was in fact his son, or did he just take a liking to him in old age having spent years utilising his sisters as housekeepers? Perhaps this is another instance where Kirk Session Minutes might shed some light?

Regards

Lorna

In the 1891 census where William TAYLOR appears as Son to the Head of Household, 71 year old Peter GOVANLOCK, it would be Peter who filled in the census return, or provided the info to the enumerator.

Use of relationship terms was much looser back in the 19th C, and it's often the case that "Son" is used when the correct term would have been "Adopted Son".

As regards Peter Snr's death in 1897, the registrar had no authority to question what the informant stated as their relation to the deceased!

Can you place William TAYLOR's mother Alison in Peter GOVANLOCK's household at around the time of William's birth as housekeeper or domestic servant to the single Peter?

In 1891 the housekeeper is a Janet STORIE with no-on else in the household apart from "Son" W^m TAYLOR, - note also the other GOVANLOCK household at the top of the page, surely connected, given this most unusual surname; in 1881 Peter Snr's sister Catherine HUTCHISON is Housekeeper; in 1871 his sister Elizabeth GOVANLOCK is housekeeper, with no-one else in the household; and in 1861 his sister Isabella KERR is his housekeeper (see the other household in the 1891 census), with sister Margaret GOVANLOCK the other person in the household. So it doesn't like like Alison TAYLOR, as housekeeper or a domestic servant was "warming his bed" at the time of any of the censuses !

If the Kirk Session records don't assist it may never be possible to determine if William TAYLOR was Peter GOVANLOCK's natural or adopted son.

By the late 1800s, however, the Church of Scotland was taking a much less strict view of extra-marital dalliances, certainly compared to a 100 years earlier, and the previous procedures involving the sinning couple being hauled up before the session and cross exanined, and made to perform penance at several Sunday services were rarely enforced.

mb

[Lorna Allison]

Hi mb

Thanks about the reminder on William Taylor / Peter Govanlock. Funny how a nudge gets you going again and suddenly where all was brick wall before SP seems determined to wave the magic wand and now I'm £** pounds lighter Well Alison had 5 illegitimate children, she was a domestic servant and the children were shunted on to Mum and Dad until 1871 when she went to stay with them too.

I have found her death reg. (1913) signed by son George and living at Morebattle Mains, Yetholm. By that time son William had come into his inheritance but the 1901 Census says his farm (unnamed) was in Kirk Yetholm. Funny to be unnamed must look out that copy - but - now 2am (and all money spent) It was really exciting, thanks for that. I really must find out how to get a look at a 1924 will, would love to know how William/Peter left his money.

Regards

Lorna

[Montrose Budie]

Hi mb
.....snipped.........

I have found her death reg. (1913) signed by son George and living at Morebattle Mains, Yetholm. By that time son William had come into his inheritance but the 1901 Census says his farm (unnamed) was in Kirk Yetholm. Funny to be unnamed must look out that copy - but - now 2am (and all money spent) It was really exciting, thanks for that. I really must find out how to get a look at a 1924 will, would love to know how William/Peter left his money.

Regards

Lorna

Hi Lorna

For the will, you need to write to National Archives of Scotland in Edinburgh, address H.M. General Register House, 2 Princes Street, Edinburgh, EH1 3YY, with the details and enclosing a cheque for £6 which is what they charge to search for the will. Assuming that they locate it, then you get a copy of the confirmation (Scottish equivalent of probate). For another £6 you will get a copy of the testament (Scottish equivalent of will).

If you are certain that a will exists, and has been through the process of confirmation, then you can send £12 in the first instance, but note that, unlike the situation in England, there is no legal requirement in Scots Law for confirmation (probate) to be obtained.

As long as the executors are agreed and any debts, tax liabilities etc. are met then the estate can be settled by the executors in accordance with the instructions of the deceased as laid out in the testament, without confirmation. This is the same in several other European countries.

If confirmation didn't take place, and a solicitor was involved in preparing the will, then there's a reasonable chance that a copy of the testament will be found in The Register of Deeds, but I don't know if an index exists for 1924, and, of course the entry in the Register of Deeds may be some years before 1924.

Another difference in Scots Law is that an unwitnessed will, in the deceased's own handwritting, or even typewritten but with the handwritten annotation on each page "adopted as holograph" and a signature, is perfectly legal. Obviously the document it needs to be signed by the person, at the end.

If you live outside the UK, I suggest an email to enquiriesATnas.gov.uk to find out how to arrange payment.

mb

[Lorna Allison]

Thanks very much mb

Letter written. Live in hope.

Lorna