Not the luck of the Irish.

rob.mac · Post by **rob.mac** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 12:26 am

Having already had 2 sets of G/Grand parents from my fathers side of family traced back to Ireland, it was with great relief that on tracing G/grand parents on mothers side of family that i was able to trace one set back to early 1700's in Scotland.
But on trying to trace the other set of G/Grand parents has been a nightmare.
On trying to trace Henry Courtney(1875) i have been able to locate his marriage cert & 1901 census. Tried finding his birth cert & got no matches.
According to 1901 cesus he was born in Holytown, so record of birth must be kept somewhere, but Not on SP site.
Tried census of 1891, 1881 for him and got 1 return, diff person.
Tried census of 1881 & 1891 for his father John and got 4 diff families.
Tried diff ages for father John, 18-30, 30-40 & 40-50 and still only got diff people.
Eventually tried his mother Ann(1850) & got a return in 1891 census. Both staying with other male, none married to male.
Henry's birth place is again listed in census as Holytown.
Ann's birth place given as Ireland.
Tried to locate death cert for John Courtney(c1850), either got nothing or was getting wrong person.
Trying to find out if John is also Irish as i can't locate marriage cert on SP site.
If he is Irish then i need to locate marriage cert to find location where born.
As for Henry was he actually born in Holytown, if so how come i can't locate birth cert on SP site ?
As for having so many Irish ancestors, whatever happened to the luck of the Irish ?
Lucky white heather anyone?

Rob.

LesleyB · Post by **LesleyB** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:03 am

Hi Rob
Not sure I am following this:

On trying to trace Henry Courtney(1875) i have been able to locate his marriage cert & 1901 census.

Do you mean he was born in or around 1875?
What year did he marry? Who did he marry & where did he marry?
Where was he in 1901?

Best wishes
Lesley

Post by **SarahND** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:07 am

Hi Rob,
Here they are in 1881. The Ancestry transcription will give you some idea of why you couldn't find them!

1881
37 Muir St, Hamilton, Lanarkshire
John Kirkwood, 58, Head, born Barnery, L B Shir, Coal Minn
Am Kirkwood, 44, Wife, born Ireland, Miner Wife
Mary Courtany, 10, Daugher, born Holytown, Lk. S., Scholar
H Courtany, 6, Son, born Holytown, Lk. S., Scholar
Alx Mathias, 33, Lodger, born Ireland, Coal Mine
Mary Mathias, 36, Lodger, born Ireland, Miner's Wife

Now... why John and Am (Ann!) are Kirkwood, when their children are Courtany, is another interesting question! Maybe look up his birth under Kirkwood??

All the best,
Sarah

Forgot to put the census place, and have just put it in

rob.mac · Post by **rob.mac** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:28 am

Hi Sarah, Thanks for the info.
Still confused. In 1891 cesus.
Address is given as 36 Gilbertfield Buildings, Cambuslang.
Head of Household is James Allison aged 50, coal miner, b. Ireland.
Then it is Ann Courtney aged 50, not employed, b. Ireland.
Then comes Henry Courtney aged 16, coal miner, b. Holytown.
Ann has reverted to the surname of Courtney and is now only 50yrs old.
Relation by head of household to others is none. Not boarder or husband.

Rob.

rob.mac · Post by **rob.mac** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:38 am

Hi Sarah,
Have tried Henry using Kirkwood surname and drew a blank. Also tried for Mary Courtney and also drew a blank.
Is there any birth records on these 2 people at all ?
Getting really confused now.

Rob

Post by **SarahND** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 1:46 am

Hi Rob,
What was Ann's maiden name on Henry's marriage cert? have you tried the children's births under her name?

Regards,
Sarah

rob.mac · Post by **rob.mac** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 2:41 am

Hi Sarah,
Ann's maiden name was Johnston. But already tried using this and got zero results .
At time of his marriage his father John was already dead and it was entered as John Courtney. Have searched for his death cert from 1874 onwards and got zero results. Did this also with Henry 1874 - 1876. and got zero results for his birth records.
Thought i would have found him in 1881 census ,but got diff family.
Have 1871-1901 census reports, about 8 in total and only 2 with any info.
Have 4 death certs, various ages, 0 matching what i need.
Running out of ideas credits and patience with this one.

Rob.

Post by **SarahND** » Thu Mar 05, 2009 3:26 am

Hi again,
Have you tried Ann's death cert to see if there is anything illuminating?

Ann Johnston other surname Courtney died in 1900 in Blantyre, Lanark aged 60

Keeping my fingers crossed,
Sarah

Lanarkshire Lassie · Post by **Lanarkshire Lassie** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:04 pm

This is my first post/ reply.

As my family come from Holytown, from 1840's it struck a note of interest.

Having begun to look at my tree, I realise that certain names may have been mis-transcribed. Or, you may find that a 'certain' story, which you believe to be true, is infact, untrue.

My great aunt, always told me the story of her grandfather remarrying. There was mention of him having a 'housekeeper'.But, I was told, it was not appropriate, for the 'housekeeper' , to live under the same roof, as grandfather.

Later, when going farther back with my tree, what do I find?

My great aunt's grandfather( my gt gt grandfather)subsequently married his housekeeper. However, prior to their marriage, they had a son!

It would appear that going back a number of generations, that certain discretions, were not acknowledged.

Doesn't help us much, though, does it?

Happy to be aboard.

Gail x

Post by **Anne H** » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:41 am

Hi Gail,

Our ancestors can certainly keep us on our toes...I know I've had several little surprises.

Just wanted to welcome you to TalkingScot.

Glad you joined us.!

Regards,
Anne H