Russells of Galston

[shaigh]

Can anyone help with any information about the Russell family? John Russell and Mary Dunlop had at least 3 children in Galston. Andrew born 30/9/1792, James 4/9/1796, Catharine 24/8/1800.

I would be particularly intersted in a death record for James, probably some time before 1841 census and possibly around Barrhead. He spent time in Loudoun and also in Eaglesham. Married Janet Kirkland (from Carmunnock) in 1819 and they lived in Eaglesham until at least 1821.

[nelmit]

James and Mary had a son William in 1834 at Eaglesham so were living there till then but I'm not finding any of them in 1841.

This could be James's father and sister in 1841 but maybe you have this.

Piece: SCT1841/561 Place: Eaglesham -Renfrewshire Enumeration District: 2
Civil Parish: Eaglesham Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 2 Page: 3
Address: Dunwan

Surname First name(s) Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
DIXON John M 40 Farmer Outside Census County (1841)
DIXON Chatrine F 40 Outside Census County (1841)
DIXON Andrew M 15 Renfrewshire
DIXON Mary F 12 Renfrewshire
DIXON Marion F 10 Renfrewshire
DIXON John M 8 Renfrewshire
DIXON William M 5 Renfrewshire
DIXON Robert M 3 Renfrewshire
DIXON James M 1 Renfrewshire
RUSSELL John M 75 Independent Outside Census County (1841)

Regards,
Annette

[shaigh]

Hi Annette

Thank-you so much for this. Catharine married a John Dixon so this is almost certainly them. John Russell seems about 4 years too young by my reckoning but that depends on an uncertain birth date and it would make sense for him to be living with Catharoine if his wife,Mary, had died. Was John registered at the same address?
I had a few children of this marriage but not all these so this is very helpful.

I knew about William - he is my 2Xg grandfather and emigrated here to nerw Zealand in 1863. I have him born in eEglesham and living in Carmunnock 1841 but have never been able to find him on the 1851 or 1861 censuses. He was in Old Monkland for his brother's marriage in 1856 as he was a witness.

What does "outside the county" mean in this record? And where did you find the record - I must admit I have not searched the Ayrshire censuses very thoroughly as I have only found this connection quite recently.

Thyans again for the information and the quick reply.

Regards
Sue

[trish1]

Hello Sue

Outside the county means somewhere in Scotland other than Renfrewshire (the county where the family is living). In 1841 if born in Scotland, the only additional census information re birthplace was whether one was born within or outside the county where living. In regard to age - the 1841 census adult ages were rounded DOWN to the nearest 5 years, so if John was between 75 and 79 in 1841 he would be listed as age 75. As you thought he was 79, this would fit with the age listed by Annette.

There are some census records available on Freecen
http://www.freecen.org.uk/ - Renfrew is 78% complete for 1841 - and the Dixons are listed there - John Russell is part of the household.
http://www.freecen.org.uk/cgi/search.pl

If you have access to ancestry census records they have transcriptions (which often contain errors) of the Scottish census records. The images & indexes are available at http://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/ which you can search for free but is otherwise pay to view.

Trish

[SarahND]

Hi Sue,

I knew about William - he is my 2Xg grandfather and emigrated here to nerw Zealand in 1863. I have him born in eEglesham and living in Carmunnock 1841 but have never been able to find him on the 1851 or 1861 censuses.

The family can be found under the spelling Dickson in Dunwan, Eaglesham in 1851. In the Ancestry transcription William is only 5, rather than 15 as one might suppose, … but the others are all more or less the right age. Catherine's birthplace is given as Loudoun, Ayrshire ("London" in the transcription...).

In 1861 Catherine's birthplace is New Mills, Ayrshire. The children seem to be servants in various households in the area, although Marion has moved to Glasgow. The odd thing is that William continues to be 10 years younger than he was in 1841 Were there two Williams and one died? How old was William when he died in New Zealand?

All the best,
Sarah

[nelmit]

Hi Sarah,

It's William Russell we're looking for.

I don't know why this didn't show up before when I searched but here they are in 1841 from FREECEN.

Piece: SCT1841/631 Place: Carmunnock -Lanarkshire Enumeration District: 1
Civil Parish: Carmunnock Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 1 Page: 13
Address: Village Of Carmunnock

Surname First name(s) Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
RUSSELL Janet F 45 Washerwoman Lanarkshire
RUSSELL William M 7 Lanarkshire
RUSSELL Janet F 4 Lanarkshire
JAMIESON Mathew M 20 Cotton Hand Loom Weaver Lanarkshire
JAMIESON Archibald M 15 Cotton Hand Loom Weaver Lanarkshire

Janet's still alive and living with Janet in 1861 and 1871 when Janet junior is married to Robert Hetherington.

Regards,
Annette

[SarahND]

Hi Annette

It's William Russell we're looking for.

Oops! That should teach me to try to answer posts when I'm jet-lagged I understood Sue's second post to refer to the William Dixon on the 1841 census you posted! Ah well, maybe she'll be interested to know what happened to the Dixon/Dicksons as well!

Cheers,
Sarah

[nelmit]

This may be a total red herring but there is a death registered for a James Russel (only one l) at Neilston in 1836. According to census records Janet junior was born at Neilston in 1837.

Back to William................Do you have proof that your William is the son of James Russell and Janet Kirkland? I know you say William was a witness at Andrew's wedding but how do you know it was your William and not perhaps a cousin.

Regards,
Annette

[SarahND]

Married Janet Kirkland (from Carmunnock) in 1819 and they lived in Eaglesham until at least 1821.

Do you have proof that your William is the son of James Russell and Janet Kirkwood?

Okay, now I'm really confused
Is Janet's surname Kirkland or Kirkwood?

James Russell and Janet Kirkland had children according to the IGI (all submitted):
Marriage: 19 Nov 1819 in either Eaglesham or Carmunnock

John born 24 Jan 1820 Eaglesham
Matthew born 22 Dec 1821 Eaglesham
James chr. 29 Aug 1824 Loudoun
Andrew chr 17 Sep 1826 Loudoun
William christened 1 Jun 1833 Eaglesham or born 21 Apr 1834

There are no births to James Russell and Janet Kirkwood, nor marriage

Searching for Russells born in Eaglesham, there are both a Marion Russell (28) and a Robert Russell (20) who are sister and brother-in-law in the household of Archibald Bulloch in East Kilpatrick, Stirling in 1851. Archibald's wife Mary was also born in Eaglesham abt 1821. The names in the family are very like the names in the Dixon family (Robert, Marion, etc.) so I assume they are related.

Matthew Russell born abt 1821 in Eaglesham is a farm worker in Kilsyth, Stirling and looks to be the one submitted as a son of James and Janet

There is a William Russell age 18, a factory worker born in Scotland, a lodger living in Manchester in 1851. Also a lodger in that household and born in Scotland is a Margrett Russell age 35, married (but no husband in the household). Could this be a sister or sister-in-law of William?

There is a William Russell age 28, born Glasgow, Scotland, a lodger in Islington East, Middlesex in 1861. He was an agent for some company and unmarried. One can imagine that from the vantage point of London, "Glasgow" would be precise enough to encompass Eaglesham as well.

Well, the above are some ideas, but given the state of my brain today, feel free to discount them all!

The death that Annette found for James in Neilston sounds promising!

All the best,
Sarah

[nelmit]

It's Kirkland Sarah - I keep doing that even with searches!! My only excuse is that I know somebody with that name.

Regards,
annette